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Today, we’ll be talking about changes to the post-pen effects for APHE shells used by ground vehicles that we plan to introduce into the game. We’re ready to show you what we have planned here, and at the end of this news post you can participate in voting for or against — whether there’ll be changes or not all depends on your vote. Let’s take a look!
Preserving fragments in the head part of the shell
First off, we’d like to tell you about a change that we consider necessary and will be implemented into the game without any vote. This change relates to maintaining the integrity of an APHE shell’s head after armor penetration. When an APHE shell explodes, its warhead is not subject to significant fragmentation and can cause substantially greater damage than the scattering fragments of the case and base.
The fragment of the shell’s warhead is significant in mass, can penetrate armor of considerable thickness, and at the same time also form secondary fragments when penetrating armor. This change will allow the warhead to better hit enemy crew members located behind internal partitions, such as the engine compartment bulkhead, as well as other modules along the shell’s flight trajectory that cannot be penetrated by small fragments generated from the shell exploding.
Increasing secondary fragments and high explosive damage
Due to a number of technical reasons, secondary fragments from APHE shells differ and are worse compared to fragments from regular, solid AP shells. When reworking fragmentation fields, we’ll enhance the secondary fragments of APHE shells to the level of solid AP shells.
The high-explosive damage from APHE shells will remain — it causes relatively little damage, affects the crew and modules inside the tank and has a damage zone in the form of a sphere around the detonation point of the shell. The diameter of the damage sphere of high-explosive damage is noticeably smaller than the scattering zone of secondary fragments.
Implementing fragment areas
Here are the changes that we’d like you to vote on, whether they’re introduced or not will be determined by community vote: scattering sectors of fragments from APHE shells.
When a shell explodes, three main fragmentation areas are formed, shown in the image below:
- The remainder of the shell’s head and its fragments.
- Fragments from the base of the shell.
- Fragments from all sides of the shell (the case).
When a shell explodes inside of a tank or armored vehicle, the shell’s head acts as a small solid AP round and may penetrate more internal modules. Alongside this, smaller fragments from the shell casing form a fragmentation cone and hit the crew and modules around the explosion point. We plan to implement both of these to the game.
*Translation (Pic.113): Scattering of the APHE shell fragments on impact
At the moment, we use a simplified fragmentation pattern for APHE shells in the game without segmentation into different areas. If we were to implement the proposed physically reliable sector fragmentation patterns for APHE shells, the post-pen effect of APHE shells will be more realistic. However, when hitting protruding modules, such as the commander’s cupola, the probability of crew damage would be reduced.
Reworking the post-pen effects of APHE shells can change the tactics of the game, making protruding weakened areas less vulnerable. However at the same time, post-pen effects after penetrating the hull of a vehicle due to the preservation of the shell’s head after the shell explodes will be increased.
We’d like to hear your opinion on this — share it in the comment field and vote Yes or No for the changes to post-pen effects in the poll!
In-game examples of the described changes
Here’s some screenshots of how damage to ground vehicles will be altered with the changes implemented.
Post-pen effect when penetrating the center of a tank without preserving the head of the shell (before) vs while preserving the head of the shell (after):
Before
After
Post-pen effect when the commander’s cupola is hit by a spherical spread of fragments from a shell explosion (before) vs hit with a physically reliable sectoral scattering of fragments from the shell explosion (after):
Before
After
We’re planning to give players the opportunity to test these changes in a special game event, as well as the “Protection Analysis” menu, before applying these changes to all APHE shells in the game. However, preparing this testing will require some significant time from the development team, so today we want to collect your opinions on whether you’re interested in switching to a more detailed damage model for APHE shells. So, shall we test it?
If you’re interested in testing, we’ll start preparing it and will host another voting on this change based on its results.
Comments (262)
Comments will be premoderatedCan we finish proper implementation of previously added mechanics before starting new ones? Volumetric is still broken and inconsistent. There's just this massive grind to make things "more realistic" while we also add incredibly unrealistic things into the game for the sake of content. Like...make a stance guys. I doubt most people even understand the gameplay implications of this.
No way people here think solid AP should be doing more than APHE.
I actually believe this is a very welcomed change. Far too many vehicles can easily be taken out by the current APHE model, it simply doesn't make any sense for those cheeky shots to win. Plus having more spalling it seems with APHE rounds sounds more in line with full AP so far. Sounds like armor can act as armor with this update. Alternatively you can still take out someones barrel or breach and track them to get on the sides or rear of them. Seems nothing changes in engagment rules there.
Finally it came to be. I hope one day we will come around differenciating steel armor by how brittle it is making historically accurate "no pen all crew dead by spalling" possible on T-34 and rest of the T (up to T-55) gang possible. Or making APHE having a chance to over-pen on super thin armored tagets.
Nerfing the only consistent ammunition instead of buffing the weak ones. It's like they're trying to ruin the game
Yes, please! APHE is greatly overperforming due to the full radial fragmentation, this will make the game immensely more enjoyable and prevent shots from one tapping when they shouldn't.
Wow... so Japanese mid tier will be absolutely nuked with this change. Na-To,Chi-Nu II, Chi-To's and Chi-Ri will suffer after this because is primarily shell is APHE (even the Kou ammo type). Hardly agre with the change... But i see the infamous 57 from T34-57 and ASU-57 will be doing even MORE damage?
Shouldn't the side cones, and to a lesser extent the rear cones be affected by the shell velocity? ie if a shell pierces a tank with just enough armour to trigger the fuse, shouldn't the fragment cones be more forward-facing as opposed to a scenario where the shell can just barely penetrate the armour?
By voting yes, you should be aware that this "improvement" will not lead us to better gameplay. Tanks must be destroyed by a single shell hit, and not be able to respond, that's the realism. This change will destroy the main projectile that you can be sure of. It will be a lot of fun to see how your projectile "hits" the center of enemy equipment, and it kills you in one shot. People, don't vote for this "improvement", open your eyes, newbies with CD < 1, these changes are not fair.
Good news. More realism is really needed, so don’t forget to remove gun sight in same time to improve the gameplay.
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